Want to get into Slalom.

[seigfreid]

I already longboard and I'm interested in Slalom. What kind of deck, wheels and trucks should I get. Any beginner tips? What kind of hills and speed should I start with? Any help is appreciated.

[TwinTown Skater]

Take a look at sk8kings. Richie and Maria can hook you up with a GREAT starter setup. They'll even customize the bushings for you based upon your weight. Lots of folks start with an Axe 1 for tight slalom.

Although you can make do with tin cans or dixie cups, a good set of cones is a great investment. However DO NOT buy those little cones that are minature traffic cones with the small square foot at the bottom. They have a nasty habit of stopping your board while you continue.

Then get out and practice. Start with the cones wide apart 7-8 foot, and then shorten the distance. The steeper the hill, typically the longer the distances btw cones.

[Work in Progress]

I've never ridden it but I've heard awesome things about flexdex's Slalom 30, not to mention it looks awesome. It's cheap too.

[Parallel Man]

Seigfried,

You'll get a lot of recommendations and some downright spamming for answers when it comes to equipment.

Slalom NOW. You have a skateboard. It makes no difference if it's a "slalom board," a longboard, a popsicle stick or whatever. Go slalom. Set up some markers and "S" turn through them. The more you do it the faster you will go. Eventually, (and really "just like that") you'll feel your board ACCELERATE from cone to cone because of your PUMP. When that happens it's like the first time you kissed something other than your relatives.

Just do it, dude. Don't wait for everything to be just right. You're in Palo Alto? That's great. There is a HUGE slalom scene in the south bay area. Judy Oyama, Bruce "Norski" Bjorkveldt, Gary Holl, Cat Young (who's very active on this forum) run cones almost every weekend. Find them and go to a session. You'll be BURIED in difference kinds of boards, trucks and wheels to try.

But in the meantime, go skate and run some markers. Easy course marker: 20 oz. plastic bottle WITH THE SCREW CAP. Fill it half way with dirt, sand or water. Put the cap on. VOILA! Hit it and it bounces out of the way. If a car runs over it big deal. Go make another. 20-25 are more than enough to set a course.

And just set a course. If you can't make it then ease up. If it's too easy then make it harder. But don't wait for all the answers to be the perfect slalom skater. Go do it.

[anatharc]

not feeling like making a new thread so ill just hijack this one.

i recently learned how to pump and would love to get into slalom.

i pump all my boards but might make a dedicated setup sometime, so few questions:

fullbag TS vs landyachtz pocket knife? about 23 bucks cheaper for the landy. and looks similar. id be using the 19" wheelbase anyway so the customizability is no prob. i like the kicktails. what are your guys' thoughts?
Landyachtz .. longboards 31" Pocket Knife Deck : The Longboard Store

Indies: i see lots of bennett front trucks. would indies work well? i like to modd them with longer kingpins for more bushing power btw. or do they turn less than bennetts? i also heard that bennetts break easier than indies, true?

softer or harder bushings? softer is easier to turn into, but i hear they have less rebound. should i do massive splits in duro? (like 83a top and 92a bottom). cones or barrels?

i got some wedge risers, wedge the front and dewedge the back? what does that do exactly. i have symmetrical truck setups on all my boards and like to use both trucks for pumping. what advantage does a less responsive rear truck have?

split duro wheels. do i need em starting out? how does it handle cruising/ldp/commuting?

[Mig]

fullbag TS vs landyachtz pocket knife? about 23 bucks cheaper for the landy. and looks similar. id be using the 19" wheelbase anyway so the customizability is no prob. i like the kicktails. what are your guys' thoughts?

I know I'm biased but they are not similar at all. The Pocket Knife looks more like a mini cruiser with the rear truck in front of the kick and not under it, like you need for slalom. The Fullbag TS is a dedicated, tested and proved, specificaly designed slalom board. Kelian Duplain just got two 2nd places in the Hybrid and Tight on the Fullbag TS at the World Slalom Championship, which made him the Overall Junior World Champ. He also rode the Fullbag GS to a 4th place in the GS.

Indies: i see lots of bennett front trucks. would indies work well? i like to modd them with longer kingpins for more bushing power btw. or do they turn less than bennetts? i also heard that bennetts break easier than indies, true?

No, at least not in a slalom application. And Indy doesn't make the 101/109 size anymore, which was the one that worked great for slalom.

softer or harder bushings? softer is easier to turn into, but i hear they have less rebound. should i do massive splits in duro? (like 83a top and 92a bottom). cones or barrels?

Softer in the front harder in the back. Reflex barrels work fantastically well in the front with a Bennett. Venoms have very good rebound too.

i got some wedge risers, wedge the front and dewedge the back? what does that do exactly. i have symmetrical truck setups on all my boards and like to use both trucks for pumping. what advantage does a less responsive rear truck have?

Basically, wedging the front adds turn and dewedging the rear makes it avoid oversteering, add traction, and follow the front through the line.

split duro wheels. do i need em starting out? how does it handle cruising/ldp/commuting?

No. You can start with one duro all around. You can later buy two harder wheels for the front or two softer wheels for the rear, once you get the knack of it.

[anatharc]

No, at least not in a slalom application. And Indy doesn't make the 101/109 size anymore, which was the one that worked great for slalom.

bummer. why would 129s not be good?

would you suggest bennetts all around then? can you exchange kingpins on the bennetts easily? is the KP long enough for reflex barrels and tall cones?

edit: forgot to mention. this is more for casual use. not planning on winning races anytime soon.

moar ed1tz: how does the TS handle wear and tear. if i bang it into stuff will it break or is it pretty durable?

[Mig]

bummer. why would 129s not be good?

would you suggest bennetts all around then? can you exchange kingpins on the bennetts easily? is the KP long enough for reflex barrels and tall cones?

edit: forgot to mention. this is more for casual use. not planning on winning races anytime soon.

moar ed1tz: how does the TS handle wear and tear. if i bang it into stuff will it break or is it pretty durable?

129s are too wide for real slalom and the geometry is not what it used to be.

Bennett 4.3 is perfect up front but too turny for the rear. No need to change the KP, it's long enough to fit double Reflex barrels. Get a 106 Tracker RTS for the rear instead.

TS handles wear and tear very well and is pretty durable, thanks to the top and bottom Arborite plies. But keep in mind it's not a trick board but a slalom board. If you try jumping or ollieng a 6 set and landing with both feet in the middle, well that's not what it was designed for...

[anatharc]

thoughts on randal 125s?

[Looptail]

bummer. why would 129s not be good?

would you suggest bennetts all around then? can you exchange kingpins on the bennetts easily? is the KP long enough for reflex barrels and tall cones?

edit: forgot to mention. this is more for casual use. not planning on winning races anytime soon.

moar ed1tz: how does the TS handle wear and tear. if i bang it into stuff will it break or is it pretty durable?

* 129s = too wide;
* Bennett rear = forklift truck steering = sudden and painful death;
* Yes, the Bennett geometry needs tall bottom bushing. So the kingpin will take 2 big bushings (eg Abec Retro barrel & tall cone or 2 tall cones)


Don't go with 129 hangers: They're just too wide.
If you're coming from wider trucks, you might THINK 129s would be fine. But 5 minutes trying to wrestle those "wide" hangers through the cones and you'll wish you'd gone with the narrower ones. You can tweak the wedging and bushings all you like: A narrower track (narrower hanger) will out-turn a wider one.

If you already have 129s and no money to buy narrower hangers, then use what you've got - Think of it as an "equipment handicap" and remind yourself how much faster you'll be when you can afford narrower trucks

If you're buying new trucks: Bennett front; Tracker RTS (stable) rear = the standard "budget" setup. I forget which widths they both come in, but the narrow Bennett (4.3?) is a touch on the wide side for some people. There are modified/ narrowed versions out there. But you don't need those for now. The Tracker comes in several widths. I'd suggest the 106mm hanger with the narrowest Bennett.

A Bennett on the rear will rear-steer like a forklift - NOT good.

Without getting into specialist/ adjustable trucks, basically:
Put the turny Bennett on the front & then make it more turny by wedging it; Put the stable Tracker (RTS) on the back and then make it more stable by de-wedging it. Rear-steer is not what you're looking for.

If you've got the cash, the Khiro "wedge pack" lets you tweak the angles and find the right setup (the Khiro bolt kit will save you many visits to the hardware store too, as you swap out different height wedge combos & try different things).

The nice thing about the Khiro rail wedges is they're very skinny at the narrow end. So you can stack them up / tweak your truck angles / balance (or not - it's up to you) the height of the front & rear trucks without adding loads of un-necessary height.

That one might only make sense once if you try the same thing using a stack of "normal" risers, which only come in a couple of angles and are quite thick at the narrow end.

That's the thing you'll quickly find about slalom - EVERYTHING makes a difference.

But don't get dragged into the "gear whore" thing.
Get a basic, affordable setup; Tweak it until you find something that works for YOU; And have fun.

[Joe & Nick]

+1 for everything Mig said, don't know that I can add anything except why TS? I'd start on an HS myself.

Its just a little larger so perfect board to keep in your trunk and for getting place to place. And then should be a fine board for when you want to give slalom a try. I travel all over the world with a slalom board. Its a great compromise when you don't want to lug a longboard around.

[anatharc]

thanks everyone!
anyone know where i can buy a single bennett truck ?

TS = 31"... kinda what i wanted in the size of the deck. the HS is just a little too big for me if i want some board to throw in a trunk and puts around a neighborhood or plaza.

I read somewhere that tennis balls cut in half were a good idea for "cones" in that people dont notice them as much and you know if you hit one. is that a cheap alternative to cones?

ok opinion time! alligators (71mm) or zigzags? ive ridden both but most my wheel time has been on zigs. any speed difference you vets have noticed? im used to big wheels (75+) btw.

[Topsider]

thanks everyone!
anyone know where i can buy a single bennett truck ?

TS = 31"... kinda what i wanted in the size of the deck. the HS is just a little too big for me if i want some board to throw in a trunk and puts around a neighborhood or plaza.

I read somewhere that tennis balls cut in half were a good idea for "cones" in that people dont notice them as much and you know if you hit one. is that a cheap alternative to cones?

ok opinion time! alligators (71mm) or zigzags? ive ridden both but most my wheel time has been on zigs. any speed difference you vets have noticed? im used to big wheels (75+) btw.

Zigs.

Don't even think about cutting balls in 1/2 and using those as cones - dangerous. See Wes's post below re: plastic bottles, good advice. You need height too on the obstacle. Aluminum cans work well but don't crush them down and of course they are prone to wind and blowing over. Also, stay clear of the sports cones that are looking just like good slalom cones but are thin - usually used for kids soccer games, etc. They will get hung-up under your trucks.

[apryde]

70mm 80a or 83a Zigs are what many racers use . 75mm wheels are good for maintaining speed over a longer distance without having to cross the fall line too many times as in an open GS course. 75mm wheels are harder to turn quickly and accelerate through a TS or hybrid course. I would say 90%+ of the racers use 70mm or 66mm for TS and hybrid.

As far as starting off on course setting I would do the things suggested above on a slightly sloped empty parking lot or little used road. Don't worry about speed yet, but on your form. Keep your knees bent, butt down, head up, don't lean forward too much, and work on using your arms to accelerate. Watch the videos posted of the better riders and you'll see what I'm talking about. After you've ridden awhile, film yourself, if you can, to see where you need to improve. We all can think we look like a Luca, Mitchell, Carrasco, Reeves, or any of the other great riders until we see ourselves on film.

If you decide to get into racing it would really help to have quick acceleration from the starting line. Many top Ams will loose a race to a pro, all other things being equal, within the first 2-3 cones because they can't accelerate as quickly. Many GS courses can be in the 25-35+mph range, and TS/HB courses ~15-to-low 20's

[anatharc]

wait... 25-35mph on 106 mm trucks!?!?!

holy balls that's crazy. i did 30mph once, just once, on 149s. but i cant imagine weaving around cones at that speed. ill stick to the TS and Hybrid stuff then..

[Mig]

A well tuned slalom setup can be pretty stable for a board that small. Check the following pic, Patrick Switzer of Team Fullbag going head to head with Misho Erban at Maryhill. Patrick is on a slalom board with a Bennett up front and a Splitfire on the rear.

PATRICK SWITZER // Maryhill on his slalom board

[anatharc]

Mig, you're a champ. Patrick is one of my favorite racers.
what's the WB on that board? pic or link to splitfire please?

do people use bigger boards in GS courses, or is it all preferance?

[Mig]

what's the WB on that board?

Don't know exactly. If I'm not mistaken, that's a board one of his friend's did for him. I'd guess it's around 20".

pic or link to splitfire please?

I will post some tonight. But they are not manufactured anymore. The Splitfire R1 fit's on Tracker RTX baseplates and is pretty similar to an Airflow. The R3 fits on Randal baseplates.

do people use bigger boards in GS courses, or is it all preferance?

Generally speaking, bigger wheelbases are used. But it also depends on the course design, the hill, and of course rider's preference and experience. As an example, Louis Ricard from our team chose to ride his own Pro model (which has a maximum wheelbase of 21") in the GS at the World Slalom Championship, instead of the Fullbag Death or Glory (which has a maximum wheelbase of 23.25") that he usually rides in that discipline. It worked for him on that particular hill and course, and helped him to a 4th place finish.

[anatharc]

ok. last question.

i was looking at the Tracker RT/S and noticed that the KP looked kinda too short for a double barrel thingy. is it? would it be just as easy to mod as indy trucks for longer KPs?

[Mig]

pic or link to splitfire please?

I will post some tonight. But they are not manufactured anymore. The Splitfire R1 fit's on Tracker RTX baseplates and is pretty similar to an Airflow. The R3 fits on Randal baseplates.

Here you go: Splitfire R2 on the left, Splitfire R3 in the middle, and Splitfire R1 on the right.
(Click for a bigger view)